Yellow Vest Protests in France because President Macron hiked up the tax on fossil fuels

[YaThreadTrashB!]

Then let the businesses put that on themselves.

 

[Perfectson]

@RiGGA avoiding this thread like the plague

 

[BBG]

@RiGGA avoiding this thread like the plague

nikka what? My dumbass don't be in HL, fukk you talking about what's this gotta do wit me?

 

[Liu Kang]

Its going to take an iron fist to ween us off the tit of oil. Most people aren't capable of looking at the larger picture and are primarily influenced by short term economic gain and comfort. This is part of the reason tackling climate change will be so hard. Raising taxes on fossil fuels is lightweight compared to what really needs to be done. At this point global society essentially needs to come to an abrupt halt if we are to save human civilization.
Preventing catastrophe is going to take a radical reformation on how we live our lives as human beings on this planet.
I wish it was as easy as humanity taking a break from growth for about 50 years or so to allow the ecosystem to recover on its own. And during that time we are developing a sustainable source of energy. Unfortunately its vastly for more complex than this.

I feel you on the substance but it's not just that here. As @mbewane said, it's the last of a series of misteps from Macron but still the issue at heart is not just tax raising. When the whole society is based around cars, taxing the transportation mean of the middle class is seen as another unfair measure that keeps piling up. Plus, as a Frenchie that takes public transportation every day, there's no way it can support further growth as the infrastructure is clearly lacking in maintenance.

We need to act regarding climate change that's a fact indeed but this needs to be top down, not bottom up. If you put the burden of change on the middle class, there's only so much they can bear without breaking above all as the wealthy do not share the same amount of effort (relatively speaking). If it was more evened out, it would more understood by the citizens I think. Also, Macron is a good "technician" and knows his dossiers but lacks proper empathy as a president and even though he's "right" regarding the issue at play, the citizens can't be treated as pawns on a chessboard even if it's for the greater good.

All in all, the issue is also about our way of lives. It's obvious our urban ways are the source and if you look at Paris, there's only so much you can do about it. The Périphérique is full of cars every commute hours, the suburban train lines are almost at max capacity and even knowing this, the population is still growing with more people going to work and living there.

Theory works well but practically the level of changes required to build a greener society before it's too late would basically mean wiping out an entire generation to rebuild. I'd say, let's have another WW and after it, a green Marshall Plan :trollbron:

 

[Perfectson]

nikka what? My dumbass don't be in HL, fukk you talking about what's this gotta do wit me?

read the thread, socialist scum

 

[BBG]

read the thread, socialist scum

Lmao I assume you're talking about my car and bike? I don't drive during the winter so that offsets some of that 14MPG and I can only ride my bike about 6 months out the year and even then it still gets 39MPG on average so I'm not the enemy



Plus I'm grinding for a top of the line Model 3 that does 0-60 in 4 seconds so I really won't be part of the problem then

 

[Perfectson]

Lmao I assume you're talking about my car and bike? I don't drive during the winter so that offsets some of that 14MPG and I can only ride my bike about 6 months out the year and even then it still gets 39MPG on average so I'm not the enemy



Plus I'm grinding for a top of the line Model 3 that does 0-60 in 4 seconds so I really won't be part of the problem then

oh shyt wrong person LMFAO


@Rhakim khim avoiding this thread like the plague

 

[Cynic]

Imagine being this deluded by the capitalist masters that you believe simply maintaining the status quo would be the "end of society" and the "collapse of the current way of life."


Breh, a society that must constantly grow or die IS the end of society and inevitably the collapse of the current way of life. There is NO sustainable endgame there. A large number of the Earth's resources are finite, constant growth just means death.

There are other ways. The only reason we're stuck in the "constant growth" model is because that's how the wealthy people on top stay rich off of loans-on-interest and they are far too self-interested to budge off of their fat asses. If we didn't have a huge number of people committed to wealth gained via interest, we wouldn't need a constant-growth economy at all.

and ? As a human are you not projecting the same self-interest with this fear mongering ?

Whatever comes ...humans will either evolve or die off.

 

[Professor Emeritus]

@RiGGA avoiding this thread like the plague

nikka what? My dumbass don't be in HL, fukk you talking about what's this gotta do wit me?

read the thread, socialist scum

Lmao I assume you're talking about my car and bike? I don't drive during the winter so that offsets some of that 14MPG and I can only ride my bike about 6 months out the year and even then it still gets 39MPG on average so I'm not the enemy



Plus I'm grinding for a top of the line Model 3 that does 0-60 in 4 seconds so I really won't be part of the problem then

oh shyt wrong person LMFAO


@Rhakim khim avoiding this thread like the plague

And you claim not to have reading comprehension issues.

On top of you attacking the wrong person and calling him "socialist scum" without even reading his name or his comment, you missed that I already posted on the front page and said more than you did.

Not to mention that if you had actually read the thread and not just the title, you'd see multiple people already explaining the situation and that NO ONE has caped for your reactionary interpretation since I posted.

Now, why is it that I've asked you three times now where you came from you still haven't answered?

I never once saw you until last week and now you're going extra everywhere, especially on me.

and ? As a human are you not projecting the same self-interest with this fear mongering ?

Whatever comes ...humans will either evolve or die off.

Welp, at least now we know where you got your screenname.

It's not fearmongering to use basic logic. Constant unending global economic growth is an obvious issue on a finite Earth. You have to start there.

 

[Cynic]

Welp, at least now we know where you got your screenname.

It's not fearmongering to use basic logic. Constant unending global economic growth is an obvious issue on a finite Earth. You have to start there.

Humans are finite. Earth will continue with or without us.

Good luck fighting oil interests and financiers

 

[Professor Emeritus]

Humans are finite. Earth will continue with or without us.

Not sure what point you're trying to make - humans can reproduce and thus extend the species indefinitely, but that's neither here nor there.


Triipe claimed that to pause economic growth would be the end of society and the collapse of life as we know it.

I countered that pause economic growth simply means to maintain the status quo, and to cape for unending economic growth would in fact be those very things

You are arguing...what exactly?

Good luck fighting oil interests and financiers

And what good does that sentiment do you?


"Powerful people are ruining shyt for everyone, guess I should just ignore that because they're powerful."

 

[Cynic]

Not sure what point you're trying to make - humans can reproduce and thus extend the species indefinitely, but that's neither here nor there.

You aren't sure about your own claims of a finite Earth?

Triipe claimed that to pause economic growth would be the end of society and the collapse of life as we know it.

I countered that pause economic growth simply means to maintain the status quo, and to cape for unending economic growth would in fact be those very things

You are arguing...what exactly?

The status quo is growth at any and all costs. So your counter is what exactly ?

And what good does that sentiment do you?

You are altruistic, it's admirable but not pragmatic.

"Powerful people are ruining shyt for everyone, guess I should just ignore that because they're powerful."

]]

I never said this ... Nice try though

 

[Secure Da Bag]

What?

Why would the gov't create the hike directly and have the people riot? Why not pass the law so the companies have to deal with the carbon tax? If they pass on to the consumer, then the consumer will blame the companies? But if their fuel taxes are like ours, then the gov't is taking the heat for companies. IMO, unnecessarily.

 

[Professor Emeritus]

You aren't sure about your own claims of a finite Earth?

I'm quite certain that the Earth has a finite amount of physical space, finite quantities of most minerals, and generally finite limits to how much pollution its ecosystems can dispose of at several levels.

The status quo is growth at any and all costs. So your counter is what exactly ?

"The status quo is change" only has any meaning as a slogan. From a technical perspective, is possible to maintain the status quo standard of living without continued economic growth.

You are altruistic, it's admirable but not pragmatic.

Again, sounds good as a slogan but doesn't mean anything. It's just another way for selfish people to deflect from solving problems which require us to adopt higher standards than self-interest. People prove their ability to act beyond self-interest every day.

I never said this ... Nice try though

You mocked the idea of standing up to Big Oil and Big Finance. If you weren't belittling the idea of confronting the powerful, then what were you doing?

 

[YaThreadTrashB!]

What?

Why would the gov't create the hike directly and have the people riot? Why not pass the law so the companies have to deal with the carbon tax? If they pass on to the consumer, then the consumer will blame the companies? But if their fuel taxes are like ours, then the gov't is taking the heat for companies. IMO, unnecessarily.

Why are businesses in business?