Are we finally ready to accept that rappers today are way richer than those in the 90s

[Harry B]

Most have 360 deals, so no

Jay-z has a 360 deal, are you telling me he isn’t rich? And that was his first record deal he signed, ie not distribution nor partnership deal. Bad Boy artists didn’t have 360, why aren’t they as rich as Drake? Rappers back in the day were barely pulling up in Ferraris and shyt, their flex was at he same shyt drug dealers or ordinary dentists had.

People back in the day might have not had 360 deals but a lot of them got a few cents per cd sold and performed in small venues charging 10 bucks per ticket.

People think 360 or independent style deals are the only type of deals .


It’s all about what you can negotiate in terms of percentages. Percentages that terms like 360 or not 360 say nothing at all about.

 

[Awesome Wells]

That makes them anomalies lol.

Nah, a lot of rappers had labels.

Dres from Black Sheep is one of the first to get his own label. Companies would throw a label at you in a minute to get you to sign, but a lot of dudes didn't know how to run their own label. If anything P and Puff would be anomalies for knowing how to run their companies. But a ton of dudes owned labels in the 90's. It was pretty standard.

 

[JustCKing]

Thread is comedy because cats are talking like I'm nostalgic for the 90's when I'm literally telling you what happened.

And it's not even favorable towards the 90's. It's reality. There was hundreds if not thousands of rappers back then....only a handful can tour consistently, 30 years later.

But hear you all tell it damn near every rapper from the last 5-10 years will be able to do it at will.

Fred.

This.

And what's even funnier is that they are saying these rappers now are making all this money with NO hits. What will they be able to tour with then?

 

[Harry B]

This.

And what's even funnier is that they are saying these rappers now are making all this money with NO hits. What will they be able to tour with then?

Jay-z bragged for one year about selling out the garden with cheap tickets. Tyler the creator sold out the garden like it was another Monday at work and nobody cared. Alone - and he’s from thousands of miles away.


And the dude is talking like he was rappers lawyers. Doesn’t matter if you were 45 in the 90s. You had less info on how much they were making than people have today. Since most of them haven’t talked about the bread they made until it was mentioned in podcasts, interviews, books and documentaries in recent years.

 

[Awesome Wells]

Jay-z has a 360 deal, are you telling me he isn’t rich?

By the time that deal was signed, he owned his masters and publishing. None of these rappers out here today own either of those.

His deal with Live Nation was for 10 years. The standard 360 deals that these rappers sign today, are for as long as they owe these labels money and after that. You start off in debt. There is no cut-off date. Jay’s deal wasn’t contingent with any debt incurred either. He’s not recouping on a loan with them. He was being paid $10M for each album he dropped during that stretch, away from what he's already getting from the actual record company. And then they were giving him another $45M for his publishing rights during the term and for other ventures he wanted to invest in, while he made them his exclusive tour carrier.

He’s allowing someone to be the sole booker for his touring, for a nice cut of the profits. That is nothing like what these rappers are signing up for. It’s not even close, lol.

 

[Harry B]

By the time that deal was signed, he owned his masters and publishing. None of these rappers out here today own either of those.

His deal with Live Nation was for 10 years. The standard 360 deals that these rappers sign today, are for as long as they owe these labels money and after that. You start off in debt. There is no cut-off date. Jay’s deal wasn’t contingent with any debt incurred either. He’s not recouping on a loan with them. He was being paid $10M for each album he dropped during that stretch, away from what he's already getting from the actual record company. And then they were giving him another $45M for his publishing rights during the term and for other ventures he wanted to invest in, while he made them his exclusive tour carrier.

He’s allowing someone to be the sole booker for his touring, for a nice cut of the profits. That is nothing like what these rappers are signing up for. It’s not even close, lol.

The point is you don’t know anything about the splits the artists have in their deals. Your assumptions are based on jealousy or hate cause you only assume the worst, for no apparent reason and with no particular evidence.

I can only refer to the deals I have heard of and from the few people I know who have messed with major labels. Deals are structured in an infinite number of ways. A lot of rappers from the 90s are whining about them not owning their masters and not getting any publishing either, without 360s.


And as far as debt goes, recoupment is nothing new. And it’s not a debt such as bank debt, it’s merely a threshold for when your contractual obligations change. If you flop and start working at Microsoft you don’t owe the labels anything. They’ll have to write it off as a loss unlike a bank.

 

[scarhead]

The industry has matured. So the size of the pie of course has gotten bigger but with maturity (in any industry) comes rigid structures and that makes it hard for new comers have stakes and ownerships - because the game’s been figured out pretty much and all the incumbent players aren’t gonna let someone new come in and take their shyt. In the 90’s and 2000’s when it was still a new genre and the industry was fragmented there were more ways to finesse your way into ownership positions and play the long game. Fast forward to 2021, the moguls of the 90s and 2000s (Puff, Jay, P, Baby, J Prince etc) are the still the top dogs. We may see rappers today make more on avg due to them having more ways to bank on their reach and exposure but at the end of the day they’re still highly paid workers not owners. Back in the day, depending on how you played the game, you could either end up as a broke rapper or be a mogul with ownerships. Now, you could finesse your way to maybe double digit mills (which is a LOT of money) but 100s of Ms or Billy with mogul status won’t be available because it’s an established oligarchy at the top now.

 

[Ricky43]

if you think rappers are rich , i got a bridge to sell you. Smoke and mirrors fool everybody

 

[Ziploc]

Didn't know this was a debate in the first place and if they do,even more reason to pay hommage, what's your point breh?

 

[FreshAIG]

Nah, a lot of rappers had labels.

Dres from Black Sheep is one of the first to get his own label. Companies would throw a label at you in a minute to get you to sign, but a lot of dudes didn't know how to run their own label. If anything P and Puff would be anomalies for knowing how to run their companies. But a ton of dudes owned labels in the 90's. It was pretty standard.

Rappers always had labels but let's be real, all "labels" aren't the same. But labels blowing up to the extent they did is an anomaly. That doesn't happen bro. That's why there's not many in that category

And you can't lump rappers in with Diddy and Master P. They had real signed artists, with real budgets, real offices, real promotional teams, etc. They ran legit companies. Not MC Bubblefukk who made an LLC and has a couple of his homies rap under "Thugs R Us entertainment"

 

[ISO]

Nobody can see past the rappers I grew up on because that's the only example we have.
The rest of you cats are talking about what you think or hope will happen. Or do you have footage from 2040 you want to share with us?

And for the record I'm not saying nobody current gen will be touring 30 years from now. I said it's unlikely for most of them, because that's only been true for literally a handful of artists in hip-hop.

Fred.

That’s because hip hop is only about 40 years old

In every genre and era of music there’s a group of artists that are able to tour decades later because they’re cultural icons

But it won’t happen for this generation

 

[CrimsonTider]

That’s because hip hop is only about 40 years old

In every genre and era of music there’s a group of artists that are able to tour decades later because they’re cultural icons

But it won’t happen for this generation

These dudes act like 2000s artist like Jeezy and Boosie aren’t touring right now damn near 15 years after their career peaks

 

[ISO]

Cause they can't even tour 1 year later... Are we talking big artist vs big artist? Yea big artist can always tour.... my man said

"Can we finally accept that even mid popular rappers 42 Dugg and EST. Gee have alrwdy touched more paper than our favorite rappers from the 90s?"


No the fukk way 42 Dugg and EST are going to be touring in 2025, let alone 2055.. And you smoking rocks if you think either of them have touched money like "our favorite rappers from the 90s"

Do y'all know Jay Z is a rapper from the 90s

Who can’t tour one year later??

42 Dugg will be touring in 2025 he’s only getting bigger

And yes 42 Dugg has made more $ than a lot of y’all 90’s favorites

Not every rapper was Jay Z. Jay was built different and he went the mogul route from jump.

 

[BK The Great]

It's cool and all but that takes away from the actual art. You know shyt is weird when people care about these things more than the music.

 

[Awesome Wells]

The point is you don’t know anything about the splits the artists have in their deals. Your assumptions are based on jealousy or hate cause you only assume the worst, for no apparent reason and with no particular evidence.

I can only refer to the deals I have heard of and from the few people I know who have messed with major labels. Deals are structured in an infinite number of ways. A lot of rappers from the 90s are whining about them not owning their masters and not getting any publishing either, without 360s.

And as far as debt goes, recoupment is nothing new. And it’s not a debt such as bank debt, it’s merely a threshold for when your contractual obligations change. If you flop and start working at Microsoft you don’t owe the labels anything. They’ll have to write it off as a loss unlike a bank.

Not assuming anything.

I've been in the business for a while. I've seen the changes in real-time. When you've worked with or at these labels, you know how they roadmap these deals and how they do things to benefit themselves. There is a standard that's been in place for 15-16 years. Which is why dudes like Yachty don’t even know who he signed his publishing away to. He's on the front of a cereal box right now. That money goes to the label until he's recouped. He's not exactly an outlier. Deals were more dynamic in the 90's. It's not like that today at all because the losses are constant and labels aren't going to offer wiggle-room for any artist. It's not smart business.

There were always bad deals, but the deals back in the day didn't encroach on monies that were made away from the actual albums. 360's are structured to hit all of your money. Even shyt you make away from the actual music. Groups like De La Soul had shytty deals and lacked ownership, but they don't have to forfeit any bread they make touring, to Tommy Boy. They can do books, cartoons, clothes, shows, etc and make appearances and pocket all of that for themselves. They may not own those albums, but they don’t lose money on their performative royalties. The dudes in 360's today can't even get a t-shirt sold at their show, without that same money going back to the label. Every dollar made is going back to the label, until that artist has recouped every cent they were fronted in either their advance or after that with costs that covered their day-to-day expenses. That didn't exist in the 90's. Because it wasn't necessary. There was mad money being made. That's something that was enacted after the companies started seeing huge losses. You owe the label money whether or not you're still signed to them. You can flop and get a job at Best Buy. You will still owe the record label everything they fronted you.