Future - "Reasonable Doubt was not hot when it dropped"

[mobbinfms]

its the same argument yall have about RD...RD is a classic now so i guess it was a classic back then too,the right people just hadnt got to hear it yet

I don't understand your argument.

 

[mobbinfms]

nobody knew about the album when he came out on priority records

Except the 420,000 people who bought it.

 

[mobbinfms]

the source staff and Miss Infos opinions are greater than that of the collective people who decided doggystyle was a classic in real time

What does this have to do with Illmatic?

if nas was so influential why did he have to switch his style up to go commercial on his followup

Hip hop isn't about who sells the most.

Eminem has a impact on other lyricist too....streets dont give a shyt about Eminem like that,even though Slim Shady LP did have more of a impact with nikkas than Illmatic did nationally

and lyrically it was more impressive

 

[Still Benefited]

Lyrics. Elite Rhyming.

If you aint first than you last.

The phrase second coming says it all,he was rapping like G Rap,just say it.

And he definitley didnt bring back lyricism,when did nikkas stop being lyrical on the east?nikkas that blew up past Nas didnt even rap like Nas

Rakim really did that though

I dont remember Rakim having to change his sound and style up to compete and be succesful with his peers.

Not only was Illmatic not impactful,but he couldnt compete on his own coast commercially,until he switched up to sound like the nikkas who was popping commercially

Thats what yall call impact?

 

[mobbinfms]

The phrase second coming says it all,he was rapping like G Rap,just say it.

And he definitley didnt bring back lyricism,when did nikkas stop being lyrical on the east?

He was the golden child. Don't act like that's not a thing.
And of course cats on the east stopped being lyrical for a hot minute. Ask diggety Das Efx about that. Bum stiggedy iggedy

 

[Still Benefited]

What does this have to do with Illmatic?

Hip hop isn't about who sells the most.

I wasnin the trenches shytting on Eminem and still do,but am i lying?

When Slim Shady LP dropped,i remember a couple nikkas had it,and we had to pass that 1 cd player around all day....nikkas would be like "You gotta hear this"....fact is that aint happen with illmatic

 

[mobbinfms]

Not only was Illmatic not impactful,but he couldnt compete on his own coast commercially,until he switched up to sound like the nikkas who was popping commercially

Thats what yall call impact?

At the end of the day. Impact is all about who sold the most for you.
I don't see things that way.

 

[Still Benefited]

I don't understand your argument.

go back and read your post i quoted and you will.

In reality,not an alternate reality RD is considered a classic,yet nikkas want to write if off as a grand conspiracy by Jay....yall doing the same thing,talking about what wouldnt have happened if Jay never blew up....in reality Jay did blow up and people later decided it was a classic.

Its okay when that happens with illmatid though

 

[RammerJammer]

he right, it wasnt
future is old enough to remember

Yeah...Future is 32 years old

I ain't old enough to have a say so in this so I'll take his and other posters word for it

 

[Still Benefited]

At the end of the day. Impact is all about who sold the most for you.
I don't see things that way.

No its not,but its a huge factor....I broke down how it wasnt impactful in real time,RD is impactful and influential after the fact too.

Point is yall need to differentiate the different levels when it comes to impact.

Numbers and stats never seem to matter when they not on peoples side.

Meanwhile some of us have both,some of our arguments are bulletproof....some of yalls arguments got holes and inconsistencies aaallll in it

Its small impacts/love taps and then theres real impacts...if it dont matter why so many of yall tryna force these albums like illmatic to be bigger than it was?

 

[IllmaticDelta]

Now you see why listening to critics is stupid,and usually only gives you a bias pov....they said west coast hiphop in general was dumbing down...even though nikkas wasnt tryna rap like east coast nikkas out the gate...snoop aint dumb down shyt,just ignorant nikkas spewing nonsense.....west coast had plenty of lyricist at the time.

stop it...we all know the OG east coast guys looked at west coast gangsta rap as dumbing down the art form lyrically and even thematically speaking

@ 1:11

 

[karim]

Save the 1000 word essays. You are hating. It's one thin to say that this is howbuounosrsonalky felt, but to ignore people telling you that they felt differently in an attempt to project this bullshyt on everybody is another thing. Cats are telling you that the saw the greatness in the album from day one and you're trying to argue them down. Shut the fukk up and get over yourself.

 

[Still Benefited]

stop it...we all know the OG east coast guys looked at west coast gangsta rap as dumbing down the art form lyrically and even thematically speaking

@ 1:11

Exactlyni was including them in the ignorant pot too....my point was that didnt start with Snoop,so anybody citing Doggystyle or Snoop as the album that "dumbed down" hiphop is ignorant as shyt.....long before Snoop the west coast had nikkas that was lyrical and not lyrical...durimg and after Snoop west coast had lyrical and non lyrical nikkas

 

[IllmaticDelta]

fukk a critic,the source staff and Miss Infos opinions are greater than that of the collective people who decided doggystyle was a classic in real time

stop talking about the source, that wasn't the only place where Illmatic was critically acclaimed

Illmatic was more critic friendly and considered "pure",they wasnt ready for the harsh realities,and for west coast nikkas to break the mold.

Illmatic spoke on the harsh realities from an East Coast POV but with more poetic value than what was coming from the West

if nas was so influential why did he have to switch his style up to go commercial on his followup,

he didn't switch his style lyrically, he just updated the production because there was a change from 94 to 96 in hiphop sonics and even then...that was something he was hesitant to do

if he supposedly purged the wickedness from hiphop....he couldnt even manage to do that locally,and had to follow behind nikkas like wutang,and biggie who was a

you must aint listen to nas demo

Thats not impact,he didnt change shyt if he was the one who had to change to be heard in the emd....

nas didn't change lyrically... which is where his impact was made. Ya boy Pac knew what was up


"name a rapper that I ain't influence"

Tupac ends his third and final verse with a venomous tirade against New York rapper NaS, who he accuses of various hip hop crimes. According to Tupac, NaS is an impostor who stole rap legend Rakim's lyrical style ("you heard 'My Melody' . . . tryin' to sound like Rakim") and plagiarized Tupac's life story ("read about my life in the papers . . . now you want to live my life"). Behind this public hatred was a private admiration. Tupac was a huge fan of NaS' debut album, Illmatic, and was inspired to write "Me and My Girlfriend" after hearing NaS' "I Gave You Power," an anthropomorphic first-person narrative told through the "eyes" of a handgun. He made peace with NaS in New York's Bryant Park on September 4, 1996 and even listened to NaS' sophomore album, It Was Written, as he made his fateful trip to Las Vegas for the Tyson-Seldon fight three days later. According to Suge Knight, Tupac intended to remove the NaS disses from the Makaveli album but died before he could do so. In a magazine interview after Tupac's death, NaS admitted crying when he first heard "Against All Odds."

11.2 K-THORO FM: Amazing Breakdown of "Against All Oddz" (NEW INFO)

and...

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dream hampton on how pac felt about illmatic:

'Hampton credits Illmatic with providing a common artistic ground for rappers on the West Coast and East Coast rap scenes. In the 2009 essay "Born Alone, Die Alone," she recounts the album's impact on West Coast artist, Tupac Shakur. While working as a journalist for The Source in 1994, Hampton covered three court cases involving Tupac. Around this time, she received an advance-copy of Illmatic and immediately dubbed a cassette version for Tupac, who became "an instant convert" of the album. The next day, she writes, Tupac "arrived in his assigned courtroom blasting Illmatic so loudly that the bailiff yelled at him to turn it off before the judge took his seat on the bench.'

Despite these regional differences, Hampton credits Illmatic with providing a common artistic ground for rappers on the West Coast and East Coast rap scenes. In the 2009 essay "Born Alone, Die Alone," she recounts the album's impact on West Coast artist, Tupac Shakur.[108] While working as a journalist for The Source in 1994, Hampton covered three court cases involving Tupac. Around this time, she received an advance-copy of Illmatic and immediately dubbed a cassette version for Tupac, who became "an instant convert" of the album. The next day, she writes, Tupac "arrived in his assigned courtroom blasting Illmatic so loudly that the bailiff yelled at him to turn it off before the judge took his seat on the bench." In her essay, Hampton implies that Nas' lyricism might have influenced Tupac's acclaimed album, Me Against the World, which was recorded that same year.[108]

Eminem has a impact on other lyricist too....streets dont give a shyt about Eminem like that,even though Slim Shady LP did have more of a impact with nikkas than Illmatic did nationally

stop it

and lyrically it was more impressive

Pac did call nas the "ring leader" and we know why

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[IllmaticDelta]

Exactlyni was including them in the ignorant pot too....my point was that didnt start with Snoop,so anybody citing Doggystyle or Snoop as the album that "dumbed down" hiphop is ignorant as shyt.....long before Snoop the west coast had nikkas that was lyrical and not lyrical...durimg and after Snoop west coast had lyrical and non lyrical nikkas

Im talking specifically about gangsta rap from the west coast and no, most of them guys outside of prime Kurupt were not lyrical