Is the Phillies' window closed already?

[SoulController]

he hit me with WAR, breh. im not gonna front, that was the first Coli comment to actually make me mad. not so much the actual stat, but to actually insinuate that J-Ro should be making that is hilarious

not even a factor on the team this year, borderline detriment. Wilson Valdez played 99 games last year, many at short and there wasnt all that much of a dropoff.

 

[Regular_P]

Well, since he's actually playing now, I guess this point doesn't mean a fukking thing.

This post is irrelevant since you didn't even address mine and I'm not even sure what you're trying to say with this. No shyt he's playing; does that mean he's playing well? No.

So all you people saying the Phils are out of it are forgetting we've seen larger deficits erased in shorter periods of time? Recently, too.

It's July 6th and the Phils should just pack it in according to you guys? e

 

[kash10003]

ryan just crushed that ball on his first at bat, missed the homer though

he looks normal size contrary to the previous thread here/hit 500 during rehab

they gonna really need him

 

[Leasy]

The Phillies messed up hiring Ruben in the first to replace Pat Gillick.
They shouldn't signed Rollins this offseason.
They should of been traded Blanton two years ago.
Chase situation should of been handle 4 years ago when he was declining. Product of white hype since forever in Philly.
They were dumb going after all those pitchers when hitting won the world series.
Coles should of been resigned. He will leave back to Cali where he is from.
Phillies traded their prospects away when their core players were homegrown.
Manuel is a terrible manager and will always
Howard has flaws but name 10 or more players can give u 35 plus 140 plus year n year out

 

[HHR]

LOL @ Utley being a product of ANY kind of hype.

He was the best player on the team for six full years

 

[HHR]

This post is irrelevant since you didn't even address mine and I'm not even sure what you're trying to say with this. No shyt he's playing; does that mean he's playing well? No.

So all you people saying the Phils are out of it are forgetting we've seen larger deficits erased in shorter periods of time? Recently, too.

It's July 6th and the Phils should just pack it in according to you guys? e

I meant he's playing in this era, where the SS position is pretty pathetic. His value is how he stacks up compared to his peers, and over the last 3-4 years he stacks up pretty nicely.....which was my point.

Someone has to play the SS position for the Phillies...who would you rather?

And $11M a year for a 2 WAR player is a long way from terrible. It's pretty much standard actually.

 

[HHR]

he hit me with WAR, breh. im not gonna front, that was the first Coli comment to actually make me mad. not so much the actual stat, but to actually insinuate that J-Ro should be making that is hilarious

not even a factor on the team this year, borderline detriment. Wilson Valdez played 99 games last year, many at short and there wasnt all that much of a dropoff.

Wilson Valdez in 2011
OPS+ - 74
WAR - -0.7 (yes, thats NEGATIVE)

Jimmy Rollins in 2011
OPS+ - 101
WAR - 2.4

THREE WINS is pretty significant drop off.


...and I don't like Rollins at all.

 

[Leasy]

LOL @ Utley being a product of ANY kind of hype.

He was the best player on the team for six full years

Smh dude been overrated.


Havent played a full season in what 3 years. Cmon I am from Philly i kno

 

[Leasy]

MVP year was the worst that happen to Rollins. Worst leadoff hitter every swing he thinks he Bonds

 

[HHR]

LOL....135 OPS+ and elite defense at second base is what goes for overrated now.......



I mean it sucks that's hes been hurt, but calling him a product of "white hype" is outrageous.

 

[Regular_P]

I meant he's playing in this era, where the SS position is pretty pathetic. His value is how he stacks up compared to his peers, and over the last 3-4 years he stacks up pretty nicely.....which was my point.

Someone has to play the SS position for the Phillies...who would you rather?

And $11M a year for a 2 WAR player is a long way from terrible. It's pretty much standard actually.

Just because his mediocrity compares to his mediocre peers, doesn't mean he should be earning making $11 million per. His WAR is curved because his position is so garbage.

If Carlos Guillen from 5 years ago played now, he'd be the best SS in baseball. That's how far the position has fallen off. It's disgusting.

 

[SoulController]

my thing is looking at the salary comparison to WAR, give me Valdez and ill take the 10.5 saved. ill make up the wins with the money saved, i get part of it is PR Jimmy is the longest tenured guy but the contract puts the team in a hole

agree with you on Utley, until last year he was the rock of the team for years. if they can get him to play 2 out of every 3 as planned thats a big boost for them

 

[Absolut]

if youre going to spend the money to make up 3 wins, why not just trot rollins out in the 1st place for that same amount of money. a broomstick at the position is better than valdez

 

[HHR]

1 WAR is generally worth about $5M

Of course WAR is curved....you can't compare the offensive production of a 1B to a SS. Players get paid in comparison to their peers...and even a subpar Rollins compares favorably to others at his position.

I mean, Ryan Howard has averaged a whopping 2.2 WAR per year since 2007. Yet you guys think the Rollins contract is worse.

As "bad" as Rollins has been, it's much harder to replace his production at that position than it is Howard at first.

 

[Regular_P]

I can't get on board with this WAR shyt as the be-all end-all when comparing players or trying to determine their value.

Call me old school, out of touch, whatever you want, but I prefer the eye-test and under no circumstances is Rollins worth $11 million per, even in comparison to the other dregs of that position.

Howard isn't worth $25 million, but he's meant more to that team in the last 4 years than Rollins no matter how you slice it.