Question for agnostic brehs

[Fukwatutalkinwatisaylaw]

Why would god be a he? The big bang also doesn't preclude your version of god.

Read my other explanations I'm done wit this topic

 

[NZA]

False. Natural is what is. Existence exists, thus is natural.

im not using natural in a physical context, just metaphysical. im not discussing how things work within this plane of existence, but how things are on its outer edges, so to speak. this is why to me it is not inherent that it has to be this way, or that my perception of it is even remotely accurate. as it stands, the whole notion of us being here in this particular configuration is just as absurd as any other iteration of existence. pointing out that it is the only one you know doesnt make it any more sensible. seeming natural to you and actually being natural are two different things and at this high level of conceptualization, we dont appear to be capable of any more certainty than how stuff seems to us, which is again, subjective, breh.

 

[Farrinto]

Why would god be a he? The big bang also doesn't preclude your version of god.

I just reread this thread and read this. That's a question I used to ask myself as well. Now I think of it as just more proof that the religious texts were written by men.

 

[mbewane]

I have no way of knowing otherwise, it's beyond my perception. Most atheists I know are complete a$$holes. That there isn't particularly satisfying answers to the hard problem of consciousness either, that I can't be certain of what happens when I stop existing leads me to resist drawing hard conclusions.

im pretty sure that no human has the story of 'god' right. theres been a thousand gods, its a FACT that they cant all be real. logic would dictate that one of these groups isnt special

at the same time, for me to say i know there isnt a god is incredibly arrogant

If a god does exist, I don't think that he is the typical image of god that most people push. He can't be all-knowing, all-powerful, and all-loving because it's just not possible given the state of the world.

The three bolded basically sum up my pov. I cannot KNOW for sure that a God doesn't exist, not anymore than someone can KNOW for sure that a God exists.

BUT, how the supposed God is presented in monotheist religions makes no sense, because why should I believe that YOUR God is THE God, when there have been thousands of God in different cultures and eras? If anything, it's just another ethnocentric thing, which is why it baffles me that most Africans defend Christianity and Islam so much. Even Europeans : the foundations of European civilisation come from ancient Rome and Greece, both polytheists societies, who actually ripped off their Gods from Egypt and Mesopotamia (Christianity too actually).

And indeed, the state of the world means that God(s), if He/She/It/They exist(s) are either not all-powerful or all-loving, can't be both given the mess we're in.

This is about faith ; on the other hand religions are social and political constructs, so I can only "believe" in them if I agree with the principles (such as democracy for example). I don't, so that's that.

 

[tmonster]

As an agnostic atheist... aint no "gods" breh... the ONLY reason you entertain the thought is because someone gullible told you there was, without that you would have no concept of a "god" to know whether you thought it existed or not.

I disagree in general, I think, cognitively, "God", as an agent of action and cause in the universe, is a natural stepping stone, in the evolution of human intellectual quest. We are the first agent of action that we recognize, god is just a scaling up of us, to explain actions that are scales upward from those we can carry out. It's simple, but at inception so is our intelligence, especially before we joined the information age, with writing and books, giving us a cultural/societal memory and the ability to grow knowledge.

But in this modern age, with all this cultural memory available to us and all this technology, everyone should be questioning "god", we are too much aware of the automaticity of the actions and causes in the universe (God of the gaps), not to.

 

[tmonster]

Existence exists

metaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa

 

[tmonster]

it's hard to take anything seriously if you think deeply about it.

you need to keep digging this well
there is more

 

[Soon]

I just reread this thread and read this. That's a question I used to ask myself as well. Now I think of it as just more proof that the religious texts were written by men.

Yes, religious text was written by men. Who said it wasn't?

For example John says Jew 71 times and was written much later than the first 3 Gospels, also the first 3 Gospels only say Jew 16 times combined.

There actually some scripture which the Church burned because it did not like what it said and others that were not included. Books like Ephesians, Colossians, Timothy, and Titus have been considered not written by St. Paul, and most scholars reject them.

So yes, the Bible was authored by Prophets, Apostles, and Followers.

For Christians, a Sunday here and a Sunday there just doing basic research would go a long way to getting a complete picture and put things in perspective. Start with Wikipedia and Bible documentaries, and eventually start reading what secular people like Anthropologists and Archaeologist have discovered.

Official Bible Study thread on here is okay, but I only found it will only provide a small amount of info.

 

[Soon]

I used to pray and read the Bible a lot. I started to realize that when I would hear Gospel songs about how loving, caring, and forgiving God was, I would not feel that when I read the Bible. Did the firstborn of Egypt feel like that when they were killed by God for something they had nothing to do with? Also, there were contradictions too. For instance, when God repented making humans and flooded the Earth. How could an all-knowing entity repent making humans? Being all knowing, he'd know that 500 zillion years before he even created Adam and Eve that he would repent making humans. That's a logical contradiction. Also, why would an all-powerful and all-knowing entity demand that I worship Him? He's all-powerful and cares about what I think so much that he'd torture me for all eternity over it? As for me knowing that it's a possible outcome and not believing, you could say the same thing for all religions. Hell is a possible outcome in Islam, why not be a Muslim?

The story of Adam and Eve, Noah, Abraham, and Joseph were written by Moses. That's why Genesis, Exodus, Leviticus, Numbers, and Deuteronomy are called the first 5 books of Moses.

1) The story of Adam and Eve are largely from oral tradition, and the full story of Adam and Eve was not put in the Bible. A lot of what you find in the first 5 books of Moses are largely from Mesopotamia and Assyeria (especially the Biblical laws). After all the Hebrews walked into Africa through the Sinai Peninsula. Do we really believe God cared about menstruation? Its my Bible, and it is the inspired word of God, but it is also part tradition.

2) Flood stories can be found in caves all over the world. So to say it only happened to Noah is false, but Moses being the descendant of Noah wrote Noah's flood story.

3) The Old Testament presents an all-powerful God, but we can't forget the Old Testament is also largely a historical account. You have to look at it from both points of views, but spirituality in the Old Testament is God's demands on us. While spirituality in the New Testament is our fellow man's demands on us.

@Chez Lopez

 

[tmonster]

Yes, religious text was written by men. Who said it wasn't?

religious people say it is the word of god

 

[Soon]

religious people say it is the word of god

I thought I had you ignore...I don't think I ever read anything insightful from you. I'm going to correct this oversight now.

 

[Farrinto]

Yes, religious text was written by men. Who said it wasn't?

For example John says Jew 71 times and was written much later than the first 3 Gospels, also the first 3 Gospels only say Jew 16 times combined.

There actually some scripture which the Church burned because it did not like what it said and others that were not included. Books like Ephesians, Colossians, Timothy, and Titus have been considered not written by St. Paul, and most scholars reject them.

So yes, the Bible was authored by Prophets, Apostles, and Followers.

For Christians, a Sunday here and a Sunday there just doing basic research would go a long way to getting a complete picture and put things in perspective. Start with Wikipedia and Bible documentaries, and eventually start reading what secular people like Anthropologists and Archaeologist have discovered.

Official Bible Study thread on here is okay, but I only found it will only provide a small amount of info.

The story of Adam and Eve, Noah, Abraham, and Joseph were written by Moses. That's why Genesis, Exodus, Leviticus, Numbers, and Deuteronomy are called the first 5 books of Moses.

1) The story of Adam and Eve are largely from oral tradition, and the full story of Adam and Eve was not put in the Bible. A lot of what you find in the first 5 books of Moses are largely from Mesopotamia and Assyeria (especially the Biblical laws). After all the Hebrews walked into Africa through the Sinai Peninsula. Do we really believe God cared about menstruation? Its my Bible, and it is the inspired word of God, but it is also part tradition.

2) Flood stories can be found in caves all over the world. So to say it only happened to Noah is false, but Moses being the descendant of Noah wrote Noah's flood story.

3) The Old Testament presents an all-powerful God, but we can't forget the Old Testament is also largely a historical account. You have to look at it from both points of views, but spirituality in the Old Testament is God's demands on us. While spirituality in the New Testament is our fellow man's demands on us.

@Chez Lopez

The reason why I said that that convinces me that it was written by men is because the Bible refers to God as a male. The problem with your other post is that there's no proof that Moses ever even existed. If the Adam and Eve story is just a story, then why do we all bear the original sin? What is the need for baptism? Why would an all-powerful and all-knowing entity demand that I believe in Him and His far-fetched stories while providing me with no proof that he even exists? Do you take most of the OT as literal or non-literal?

 

[Soon]

The reason why I said that that convinces me that it was written by men is because the Bible refers to God as a male. The problem with your other post is that there's no proof that Moses ever even existed. If the Adam and Eve story is just a story, then why do we all bear the original sin? What is the need for baptism? Why would an all-powerful and all-knowing entity demand that I believe in Him and His far-fetched stories while providing me with no proof that he even exists? Do you take most of the OT as literal or non-literal?

1) It is not a big secret that the Bible was written by men.

2) Scholars placed the time of Exodus during the Nineteenth Dynasty of Egypt with Ramesses II, and they use this "timeline" to argue there are no "archaeological" evidence of Exodus.

But during Ramesses II's rule there are writings on a wall that already acknowledge Israel, so the Children of Israel were gone.

Also, the "Brooklyn Papyrus" and "Admonitions of an Egyptian Sage" supports that Exodus occurred and contradicts the notion there is no proof of Exodus.

They are looking in the wrong time period.

Exodus happened in the Eighteenth Dynasty of Egypt most like around Amenhotep II time period since he was the first who declared monotheism in Egypt.

3) "Original Sin", the sexual deviant Augustine of Hippo introducing the idea of original sin.

 

[Farrinto]

1) It is not a big secret that the Bible was written by men.

2) Scholars placed the time of Exodus during the Nineteenth Dynasty of Egypt with Ramesses II, and they use this "timeline" to argue there are no "archaeological" evidence of Exodus.

But during Ramesses II's rule there are writings on a wall that already acknowledge Israel, so the Children of Israel were gone.

Also, the "Brooklyn Papyrus" and "Admonitions of an Egyptian Sage" supports that Exodus occurred and contradicts the notion there is no proof of Exodus.

They are looking in the wrong time period.

Exodus happened in the Eighteenth Dynasty of Egypt most like around Amenhotep III time period since he was the first who declared monotheism in Egypt.


https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/timeline/42108d3dd9563bec7bed26d782ef1169.png

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/timeline/7e0a0f776659aae0057c70550dc031bf.png


3) "Original Sin", the sexual deviant Augustine of Hippo introducing the idea of original sin.

I have heard some theories of an "Exodus" happening, but with smaller numbers. That's way more believable than the biblical story of Exodus. You mean to tell me that God supposedly led millions of Hebrews out of Egypt along with unleashing pure hell on the Egyptians, slaying their first born, and drowning the Pharaoh and his army, and there are no records of that? Also, do you believe in baptism?

 

[Soon]

I have heard some theories of an "Exodus" happening, but with smaller numbers. That's way more believable than the biblical story of Exodus. You mean to tell me that God supposedly led millions of Hebrews out of Egypt along with unleashing pure hell on the Egyptians, slaying their first born, and drowning the Pharaoh and his army, and there are no records of that? Also, do you believe in baptism?

No records?

Ipuwer Papyrus - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Also, after Exodus, the Papyrus from those times said the Gods turned on them and Egypt was conquered thereafter without putting up a fight.

Sounds like the Egyptians were at a lost.