Why is pop/catchy music frowned upon in hip-hop/R&B?

[Killigraphy]

that's not pop that's being versatile you can make a song about females and be lyrical why was common still pretty underground compared to Nelly?

Pop music is eclectic, and often borrows elements from other styles such as urban, dance, rock, Latin, and country; nonetheless, there are core elements that define pop music. Identifying factors include generally short to medium-length songs written in a basic format (often the verse-chorus structure) as well as the common employment of repeated choruses, melodic tunes, and hooks.

It's not only pop, it's poptastic.

 

[Insensitive]

While sure, corporations dilute shyt, we know, was the alternative to not grow and expand? Country was in a good place in that their fans supported with their money and you could be Garth Brooks and Tim McGraw and sell millions yet still be what you intended to be. Rap was always gonna be at a disadvantage because in sheer numbers alone, you can't put artists on that kind of pedestal. Genres don't like losing their rigidity even if it comes at the expense of potential success. Punk and even metal to an extent live by that but ultimately their measure of success is much lower than what we consider.

If rap was as rigid as it used to be, it woulda cheated itself out of growth which ultimately benefited the genre.

Oh yeah, I agree, rigidity can be damning to monetary success, you can only appeal to so many people by pursuing a very
specific musical aesthetic. And honestly Hip-Hop's (or really Black music's) story is staying true to the people it came from
while also making enough money to support that industry and simultaneously keep Black performers from being overshadowed by
White ones. Black people being a minority in the country means eventually they'll have to "deal with the devil" to have enough
money to reach more people. However the issue that eventually comes up is "How much change happens before the genre
no longer resembles itself ?", Hip-Hop is going through just that right now while R&B already has changed to the point that
"Hip-Hop" and "R&B" are damn near interchangeable to the general public.

At some point we have to ask if monetary success is so important why even put on the facade of being "Hip-Hop" or "R&B"
and instead simply pursue a career in Pop ? Drake for example hardly classifies as Hip-Hop these days, it was just his
trojan horse to get on the national stage.

 

[A Tribe Called Quest ™]

I thought J. Cole's "Workout" was a dope feel good summertime record. Hip Hop needs those IMO...

I'm not a Missy stan but can you front on her production?

But Jadakiss bodies pop songs...






Jada influenced G Herbo and Lil Bibby

I heard the One Dance freestyle and Pop Style freestyle he did before and I know Jenny from the Block and yea it's easy to write a 16 on songs that are already constructed and all you gotta do is write a 16

 

[FeloniousMonk]

I remember something Cheo Coker said about Hammer where he said "once white people aren't afraid of you, black people feel like you're not doing your job" which is why he feels Hammer lost a lot of respect. Rap didn't care about being loved. They wanted to be feared and respected. A lot has changed.

Yeah, for the most part, we couldnt grow with the aspect of commercialization and the ideal of rap being considered "pop" music in the sense of the format and not realizing it was just a genre or category.

Hammer fell out of grace and at the same time began to fall off, then resurged doing gangsta or street music.

The hip hop community gave this nicca the faces..

And the rest is history..

 

[JustCKing]

So nowhere basically

Or basically everywhere. I mean ya'll had a thread going about how glorious it has been without hearing her. I'm certain ya'll consider yourselves hip hop heads, so I'm certain you were hearing her songs offline.

 

[JustCKing]

This is all wrong breh.

Explain. I mean Nas caught all kinds of flack for IWW. Why? The argument was that he went Pop. How did he go Pop?

 

[North]

Pop is great as long as you do it gracefully

The highest rated records are pop recordeds

Views was bland AF

Good example of a great pop rap artists is Kanye

CD LR G 808s all did pop well....without being coirny and ostentatious

 

[JustCKing]

That's because she debuted just as hip hop had become watered down. Still, you'd be crazy to say she had universal support.

She didn't debut just as Hip Hop had become watered down. 1997 still had a grimey side to it despite the shiny suits and Dre declaring gangsta rap dead.

 

[North]

IYRTITL is pop rap just like Views but its executed well

 

[North]

For example, The Weeknd released his album Beauty Behind the Madness and people say he fell off. However, BBTM was his catchiest album and the one album that is very easy to digest. It's fun.

In hip-hop, Drake dropped Views and it has fun records, but people say that it's bad because Drake went pop. J.Cole dropped "Work Out" and people claimed that he sold out, but "Work Out" is one of his best songs to me.

Is music automatically worse if it's catchy? Isn't that the point of music?

Weekend is held to higher standard then most artisrt because that nan made HOB and EOS

 

[JustCKing]

my comparison is still going over your head buddy.

all these labels looked up to Motown because it was a black label making history when they were growing up. thats as far as the blueprint goes for some of them. ala uptown & laface were like night & day.complete opposites.

you are tip-toeing around the missy thing. i asked you what hip-hop circles was she ever a hot topic in. and all you gave me was "bu bu but she has songs that get played in clubs and i saw people breakdance to 1 or 2 of her joints before".





given the nature of this thread, I'm led to believe that this thread is moreso about watered-down pop tart music.

The comparison isn't going over my head. These labels structured themselves after the model that Barry Gordy nolded with Motown. You're singling out La Face for whatever reason.

I am not tip toeing around anything. Break dancers are a circle of Hip Hop. I personally know people who bought liked and discussed Missy's music like they woukd any Hip Hop artist.

 

[ThaRealness]

hip hop is about capturing the uniqueness of a particular moment... a particular time and place.

But pop though? Every pop producer from Sweden to Tokyo is making the same damn song

 

[Jimi Swagger]

People have diverse taste and everyone isn't going to agree with 100% of what you think butt you. With that said, that Justin Bieber's Purpose album was fire and tied in different genres like Beyonce's lemonade, who is also pop and associated with Jay-Z, a hip-hop Gawd to stans.

 

[RoMans]

because hip hop is NOT pop music. It's defiant subculture. Do you understand what I mean by that?

The first good post I ever see you make fuccboii

 

[IllmaticDelta]

Why didn't you bold the part where it says teen pop enjoyed a commercial explosion?

"teen pop" is more of a market than an actual sound or distinct genre. For example this could be marketed as teen pop





because they were teens but the actual music was still soul/r&B

Face it breh, pop is a genre.

I think we are just debating semantics at this point