JJ Reddikk "Larry Bird is not a top 3 Three Point Shooter of all time."

[mvp_status]

JJ's right and if Bird didnt call game during that one three point shootout, nobody would even be arguing this

 

[CHICAGO]

They would shoot WAY better than 40%. Look at the top 25 seasons for best 3pt % and they're virtually all low-volume guys. Kyle Korver set the record for 3pt% in a season where he averaged just 2 threes a game.

Reggie and Steph especially, and to a lesser degree Ray, took all sorts of crazy shots to keep their shooting volume up because teams were doing everything possible to keep them from getting 5-10 good looks from deep every game. So they settled for lesser looks. If they only had to take 3 threes a game, they could wait for the best looks....and if they got 3 threes a game in Larry's era, those would be some damn good looks.







Yeah context matters. And the context is that Bird (and everyone else who shot threes in the 1980s) was wide open for most of his shots. The 3pt line wasn't even defended in that era until the end of games. If he had been guarded tightly his %'s would be even worse, not better.

Bird's 3pt% drops from 37% in the regular season, to just 32% in the playoffs. Do you think Larry Bird was a choker who couldn't handle playoff pressure? That seems unlikely. So the only remaining explanation is that playoff defense was a lot tougher than regular season defense on threes in the 1980s, and that had a real impact on his %'s.







You're just being ignorant. If Steph shot 3 threes a game, he wouldn't take the first three 28-footers off the dribble with a defender just barely off of him. He'd be taking the best 3 shots he got during the game.

Shot selection is a thing breh….

You think Steph would be shooting deep ass step backs with a extra defender on his hip if he only shot 3 times a game?

Nah he would be shooting those Bruce Bowen specials where the closest defender is in another zip code and probably shoot 60%

nikkaS MOST OF STEPHS THREES
ARE WIDE THE fukk OPEN
COMING OFF OF ON BALL
AND OFF BALL SCREENS.

GO LOOK AT HIS WORST SHOOTING GAMES AND LOOK AT HOW MANY
OPEN 3S HE MISSED.


​

 

[NatiboyB]

I didn't even think this was an argument he wasnt.

But who is the top 3 I'm assuming Curry/Allen/Klay?

 

[Professor Emeritus]

nikkaS MOST OF STEPHS THREES
ARE WIDE THE fukk OPEN
COMING OFF OF ON BALL
AND OFF BALL SCREENS.

HE ONLY GETS IN HIS IGNORANT
3 BAG WHEN HES ON FIRE.

GO LOOK AT HIS WORST SHOOTING GAMES AND LOOK AT HOW MANY
OPEN 3S HE MISSED.


​

According to the NBA tracker, only about 30% of Steph's threes qualify as "wide-open" (no defender within 6 feet). And like you say, most of those are coming off of screens where he catches the ball moving and has to shoot immediately while a defender closes. That's why 50% of his threes are shot less than 2 seconds after he touched the ball. Not to mention accounting for how far behind the line Steph is on some of those "wide open" shots.


That's a huge difference from a player who is just standing above the 3pt line and has time to take a normal squared-up shot with whatever motion is most comfortable cause he doesn't have to worry about the defender closing with any speed.

 

[DaKidFromNoWhere]

This a dumb argument and JJ found a lane he can roll lol

 

[Professor Emeritus]

I didn't even think this was an argument he wasnt.

But who is the top 3 I'm assuming Curry/Allen/Klay?

Curry, Ray, Klay, Reggie, Dame, and Korver are the ones who get mentioned the most. Personally I see the argument for Curry, Klay, and Dame as pure shooters, but I also see the argument for Ray and Reggie.

 

[Jplaya2023]

If all they had to do is generate 2 to 3 shots at high percentages thatd be easy. Steph and them percentages would be through the moon. Them having to generate almost ten attempts with defenses keying in on them and still have good percentages tells you all you need to know.

Larry bird hasn't done what these other guys have done and he wasn't asked to. These guys are better three point shooters cause not only can they generate a decent percentage..they can generate a high volume. Ask yourself this. Who is a more deadly weapon from three. Larry bird or Steph? Then keep it moving cause the same argument can be made with two other people. So he's not top three.

No it wouldn't be easy. Your missing context. Birds 3pt attempts back then were rarely off of offensive sets where the desired shot was a 3. Alot of times his attempts were from late in the shock clock attempts not in the design off the offense.

Obvious because of the eras they played Steph is a more deadly weapon than bird. What ill argue against you is you put Steph back in 86 and say no matter what you can only attempt 3 three point shots a game regardless if you go 0-3 or 3-3. Who would be more deadlier then? If told Larry he could shoot 12 3s a game would he be more deadlier or less deadlier. You and i both know the answer to that.

 

[Jplaya2023]

Shot selection is a thing breh….

You think Steph would be shooting deep ass step backs with a extra defender on his hip if he only shot 3 times a game?

Nah he would be shooting those Bruce Bowen specials where the closest defender is in another zip code and probably shoot 60%

So your saying the best part of stephs game (off the dribble 3s) would be hindered if his attempts were hindered thus turning him into a spotup shooter. interesting....

So without a green light, steph curry is Bruce Bowen

 

[CantStop]

the old cac was spitting about the balance. dudes giving up dunks in transition to shoot 3s

 

[Jplaya2023]

They would shoot WAY better than 40%. Look at the top 25 seasons for best 3pt % and they're virtually all low-volume guys. Kyle Korver set the record for 3pt% in a season where he averaged just 2 threes a game.

Reggie and Steph especially, and to a lesser degree Ray, took all sorts of crazy shots to keep their shooting volume up because teams were doing everything possible to keep them from getting 5-10 good looks from deep every game. So they settled for lesser looks. If they only had to take 3 threes a game, they could wait for the best looks....and if they got 3 threes a game in Larry's era, those would be some damn good looks.







Yeah context matters. And the context is that Bird (and everyone else who shot threes in the 1980s) was wide open for most of his shots. The 3pt line wasn't even defended in that era until the end of games. If he had been guarded tightly his %'s would be even worse, not better.

Bird's 3pt% drops from 37% in the regular season, to just 32% in the playoffs. Do you think Larry Bird was a choker who couldn't handle playoff pressure? That seems unlikely. So the only remaining explanation is that playoff defense was a lot tougher than regular season defense on threes in the 1980s, and that had a real impact on his %'s.







You're just being ignorant. If Steph shot 3 threes a game, he wouldn't take the first three 28-footers off the dribble with a defender just barely off of him. He'd be taking the best 3 shots he got during the game.

All of birds shooting splits falls in thr playoffs not just 3s. So what does that tell you??? Oh and stephs %s from 2 and 3 fall as well. nice try though

 

[CHICAGO]

According to the NBA tracker, only about 30% of Steph's threes qualify as "wide-open" (no defender within 6 feet). And like you say, most of those are coming off of screens where he catches the ball moving and has to shoot immediately while a defender closes. That's why 50% of his threes are shot less than 2 seconds after he touched the ball. Not to mention accounting for how far behind the line Steph is on some of those "wide open" shots.


That's a huge difference from a player who is just standing above the 3pt line and has time to take a normal squared-up shot with whatever motion is most comfortable cause he doesn't have to worry about the defender closing with any speed.

I WAS SPEAKING ON WIDE OPEN
FOR NBA STANDARDS WITHOUT
SEEING ANY STATS.

THAT 6 FEET STAT IS ABSOLUTELY CRAZY.

BUT SINCE WE'RE LOOKING UP STATS...

46% PERCENT OF HIS TOTAL SHOTS ARE
WIDE OPEN 3S FOR "NBA STANDARDS".
(NO DEFENDER 4-6+ FEET AWAY)
AND I KNEW THIS WITHOUT
HAVING TO LOOK UP ANY STATS
BECAUSE ITS OBVIOUS TO
ANYONE WHO WATCHES HIM
CONSISTENTLY.

AS YOU CAN SEE
HE BARE TAKES ANY 3S WITH
DEFENDERS ON HIS HIPS.

THERES NO SPIN ANY OF
YOU nikkaS ARE GONNA PUT ON THIS.

ITS OVER.


​

 

[Jplaya2023]

YOU SOUND STUPID AS fukk.

WEVE SEEN STEPH START
1-5, 0-5 FROM THE 3 SO MANY TIMES
BUT HE JUST KEEPS JACKING
THEM bytchES UNTIL HE CATCHES FIRE.



​

Yes these guys are confused. You got 1 cat saying steph will be bruce bowen from 3 if his attempts were limited.

The 3pt shot is a rhythm shot. The more you shoot the better you will shoot the shot. By telling steph he has to cut down 80% on attempts from 3 would have an impact on him and his game which is the point. He would be a diferent type of player. Would he be more effective or less effective i think we all would agree on the latter...

Hell people dont get it. When bird, magic, michael, etc... were growing up there wasn't even a 3pt line until they were grown men. People acting like that didnt affect how they played the game vs steph who was shooting om nba courts at 5 years old.

 

[NormanConnors]

They would shoot WAY better than 40%. Look at the top 25 seasons for best 3pt % and they're virtually all low-volume guys. Kyle Korver set the record for 3pt% in a season where he averaged just 2 threes a game.

Reggie and Steph especially, and to a lesser degree Ray, took all sorts of crazy shots to keep their shooting volume up because teams were doing everything possible to keep them from getting 5-10 good looks from deep every game. So they settled for lesser looks. If they only had to take 3 threes a game, they could wait for the best looks....and if they got 3 threes a game in Larry's era, those would be some damn good looks.







Yeah context matters. And the context is that Bird (and everyone else who shot threes in the 1980s) was wide open for most of his shots. The 3pt line wasn't even defended in that era until the end of games. If he had been guarded tightly his %'s would be even worse, not better.

Bird's 3pt% drops from 37% in the regular season, to just 32% in the playoffs. Do you think Larry Bird was a choker who couldn't handle playoff pressure? That seems unlikely. So the only remaining explanation is that playoff defense was a lot tougher than regular season defense on threes in the 1980s, and that had a real impact on his %'s.







You're just being ignorant. If Steph shot 3 threes a game, he wouldn't take the first three 28-footers off the dribble with a defender just barely off of him. He'd be taking the best 3 shots he got during the game.

Then Steph would only average around10-12 pts a game in that era. 3 pt specialist shyt

 

[Professor Emeritus]

All of birds shooting splits falls in thr playoffs not just 3s. So what does that tell you???

It tells you that defense picks up in the playoffs because teams play harder and you face better teams, and Bird's shooting was impacted by actually being defended. What did you think it was trying to tell you?

Something a lot of historically ignorant people don't realize was that until the Pistons came along, regular season defense was ASS in the NBA. Outside of the playoffs, teams didn't push hard on D until the final five minutes of the game. The Pistons were the ones who really changed the game on that note, and once they started wearing teams down it became an arms race where defense got steadily more intense until the early 2010s. That's one of the main reasons why injuries increased so much and star minutes decreased - not because of guys hitting each other, but just the fatigue of playing both ends hard for a whole game is too much.

Oh and stephs %s from 2 and 3 fall as well. nice try though

Bird's 3pt %'s fall from 38% in the regular season to 32% in the playoffs. That's a 16% drop.

Curry's 3pt %'s fall from 43% in the regular season to 40% in the playoffs. That's just a 7% drop.



So yes, everyone has a tougher time when defenses get better, but for Bird the fall-off was much more dramatic.

 

[Jplaya2023]

It tells you that defense picks up in the playoffs because teams play harder and you face better teams, and Bird's shooting was impacted by actually being defended. What did you think it was trying to tell you?

Something a lot of historically ignorant people don't realize was that until the Pistons came along, regular season defense was ASS in the NBA. Outside of the playoffs, teams didn't push hard on D until the final five minutes of the game. The Pistons were the ones who really changed the game on that note, and once they started wearing teams down it became an arms race where defense got steadily more intense until the early 2010s. That's one of the main reasons why injuries increased so much and star minutes decreased - not because of guys hitting each other, but just the fatigue of playing both ends hard for a whole game is too much.







Bird's 3pt %'s fall from 38% in the regular season to 32% in the playoffs. That's a 16% drop.

Curry's 3pt %'s fall from 43% in the regular season to 40% in the playoffs. That's just a 7% drop.



So yes, everyone has a tougher time when defenses get better, but for Bird the fall-off was much more dramatic.

Thats that new coli math