Was there a big talent gap between Tom Brady and the QB's in his era?

[Saysumthinfunnymike]

People def generally felt Manning and Rodgers were more talented. But I also remember with Manning there was a constant "but in the playoffs..." caveat at the time that kept him out of convos when it came to who was better. Brady was constantly beating Manning.

Manning has a winning record against Brady in the playoffs.

 

[premier58]

By reading a lot of these threads I get this feeling like some posters don't understand what an NFL coach actually does. Brady had the best coach of the last 30 years.

And Montana had Bill Walsh, arguably the most influential.coach in NFL history.

 

[premier58]

Manning has a winning record against Brady in the playoffs.

I thought rings didnt matter, yet youre quick to point out his winning record vs Brady. Which one is it? Do wins matter or not?

 

[Saysumthinfunnymike]

Tony Dungy turned around the Bucs and took Shaun King to the NFC championship game, but apparently he cant coach?!?! Bullshyt!! So Dungy was making Peyton choke??

That's true but it's also true that Gruden came in and won the Super Bowl with the Bucs after the Dungy teams kept getting close but no cigar...

Manning getting shut down against the Pats those first couple meetings was more about Beli than Brady... Beli has a long history of shutting down big time offenses dating back to his days as a defensive coordinator.

 

[kdslittlebro]

But by this logic, Mahomes isn't significantly more talented than his peers either. Josh Allen is arguably more physically gifted. Herbert's arm is incredible. Lamar is also incredibly physically talented his speed and arm as well (too bad he didn't run in that playoff game...).

Difference is not only can do what the others can’t, he does it at a high level. Allen is dumb as shyt at times, Mahomes is one of the smartest. Lamar gets tight, and inconsistent with his throws, Mahomes is mostly the model of consistency, especially when it’s go time. He also has a big arm like Allen, and effective scrambling (not explosive) like Lamar. It’s their weakness where his talent shines.

 

[Saysumthinfunnymike]

This is lazy analysis. Performance wise based kn advance stats, DVOA, EPA, PFF,.QBR, Brady and Manning are the two best QBs ever. You were literally just talking about DVOA in another thread, but watch you ignore how elite Brady ranks in that category. Has nothing to do with rings, you are arguing with yourself.

I have no issue talking advanced statistics but if we are going to be discussing advanced stats then you can also see that Brock Purdy ranks very highly if not #1 in a lot of categories.

But people want to talk about the "talent" around him instead. Can't have it both ways.

But are you saying Beli's scheme didn't shut down Manning in those games? He obviously did.... lol

 

[premier58]

That's true but it's also true that Gruden came in and won the Super Bowl with the Bucs after the Dungy teams kept getting close but no cigar...

Manning getting shut down against the Pats those first couple meetings was more about Beli than Brady... Beli has a long history of shutting down big time offenses dating back to his days as a defensive coordinator.

Who said anything about Brady, though? You did. I was referring.to.Mannings' shakiness in the playoffs. No reason for you to even mention Brady. Dungy still had to be a helluva coach to turn Tampa Bay around. Getting Shaun King within a drive of the SB, is legendary coacing.

 

[Saysumthinfunnymike]

And Montana had Bill Walsh, arguably the most influential.coach in NFL history.

Walsh was a legend but guess what? The team kept winning with Seifert.

 

[Saysumthinfunnymike]

I thought rings didnt matter, yet youre quick to point out his winning record vs Brady. Which one is it? Do wins matter or not?

I was correcting the poster I quoted who said "Brady was always beating Manning in the playoffs." When their teams faced each other, Manning's team won more times than Brady's teams. That's not to say there weren't other factors at play.

Why do you have an issue with me correcting someone?

 

[premier58]

I have no issue talking advanced statistics but if we are going to be discussing advanced stats then you can also see that Brock Purdy ranks very highly if not #1 in a lot of categories.

But people want to talk about the "talent" around him instead. Can't have it both ways.

But are you saying Beli's scheme didn't shut down Manning in those games? He obviously did.... lol

I have no idea who you are confusing me with, but I am a big Brock Purdy supporter!! He was the best QB this year according to film and stats. I am rooting for him. He is special, in my eyes. Why do you keep putting words in my mouth? When did I not acknowledge that Belichick put on a mssterclass on Manning in 03 and 04? I havent, so I have no idea why you keep saying that.

 

[DaRock]

When Aeschines spoke, they said, 'How well he speaks.' But when Demosthenes spoke, they said, 'Let us march against Philip.'

Being the GOAT goes beyond football IQ and arm talent; it requires an aura, a unique ability to inspire players to elevate their game. While Rodgers may have rubbed players the wrong way, Manning carried a stern demeanor. Brady possessed a special knack for camaraderie, making teammates not only respect him but also strive to give their all. His teams never lacked effort; they believed in victory and were consistently well-prepared. Listen to every damn players who played with Brady (minus CTE AB). They loved him to death.


But his arm talent is criminally underrated too




Yall have no ideas how impressive that throw really is. That ball traveled 76yds (it was angled). That's after getting abused by the giants D for 59min.

And hit Moss right in his hands...

 

[Saysumthinfunnymike]

I have no idea who you are confusing me with, but I am a big Brock Purdy supporter!! He was the best QB this year according to film and stats. I am rooting for him. He is special, in my eyes. Why do you keep putting words in my mouth? When did I not acknowledge that Belichick put on a mssterclass on Manning in 03 and 04? I havent, so I have no idea why you keep saying that.

I'm saying it because posters have stated that Brady has "more between the ears" than Manning did. What do we have as evidence of that? Beli put on a masterclass against Manning's offense twice. That has nothing to do with how well Brady played or didn't play in the games.

The issue here is people want to act like this is the NBA or something. Football is the ultimate TEAM SPORT...

Manning did generally have pretty bad defenses a lot of years which contributed to him having less Super Bowl wins. Is that his fault?

 

[premier58]

Walsh was a legend but guess what? The team kept winning with Seifert.

That 89 team was Walsh's, that is common knowledge. Just like everyone knows that the 95 Cowboys were still Jimmy Johnson's team and not Barry Switzer's. Just like the 2001 Hurricanes were Butch Davis's team and not Larry Coker's. If ppl really felt that Seifert was the driving force, then why is he not in the HOF? Why is he rarely mentioned?? You also fail to acknowledge how much Seifert underachieved with loaded teams.

 

[Saysumthinfunnymike]

That 89 team was Walsh's, that is common knowledge. Just like everyone knows that the 95 Cowboys were still Jimmy Johnson's team and not Barry Switzer's. Just like the 2001 Hurricanes were Butch Davis's team and not Larry Coker's. If ppl really felt that Seifert was the driving force, then why is he not in the HOF? Why is he rarely mentioned?? You also fail to acknowledge how much Seifert underachieved with loaded teams.

The '94 Niners are one of the greatest teams of all time by several metrics. That's Seifert well beyond the Walsh years. Was he a better coach than Walsh? Hell no... but he got the job done.

 

[premier58]

I'm saying it because posters have stated that Brady has "more between the ears" than Manning did. What do we have as evidence of that? Beli put on a masterclass against Manning's offense twice. That has nothing to do with how well Brady played or didn't play in the games.

The issue here is people want to act like this is the NBA or something. Football is the ultimate TEAM SPORT...

Manning did generally have pretty bad defenses a lot of years which contributed to him having less Super Bowl wins. Is that his fault?

Brady is on average a better decision maker than Manning. You keep referring to Belichick.as if he didnt have collapses any other time. The man set the record for pick sixes thrown in a season, which got his coach fired. He threw 19 more ints in 2002. Threw 28 ints in 98. Threw an awful pick to Polamalu that was mistakenly overturned in the 05 playoffs. 7 ints in 4 playoff games in 2006. Including two more to Ty Law when he was in KC. You are acting as if he didnt make mistakes aside from vs Belichick or something. What about those 6 inte vs SD oñ SNF in 2007? Inc three to Antonio Cromartie alone?? The 16 ints in 2009, which culminated in a pick six to Tracy Porter??!